Speaker 1 (00:00): Coming up on Art Palace. Speaker 2 (00:02): So I am already all over this. I want to do a Moroccan corn salad. Ooh. Speaker 1 (00:21): Welcome to Art Palace, produced by Cincinnati Art Museum. This is your host Russell eig. Here at the Art Palace, Speaker 2 (00:27): We meet cool Speaker 1 (00:28): People and Speaker 2 (00:29): Then talked to them Speaker 1 (00:29): About art. Today's cool person is Christian Gill, chef at BoomTown Biscuits and winner of guy's grocery games on Food Network. Did you get this from New Orleans? Yeah, Speaker 2 (00:52): So it's my new set of skull Mala beads from New Orleans. Actually, I got three sets, but these are the ones I think I like the most just because Ma beads and Buddhist and Tibetan Buddhism tradition for mantra and just being able to focus. And so I got the skull Mala. It's all about the brain and about finding your center and your thoughts and finding that balance. And there's 108 ma beads, and each one of them basically is a, they're almost, each one's like a mantra. Each one is like, don't choke anybody today. Don't choke anybody today. Speaker 1 (01:30): Is everyone okay? Speaker 2 (01:31): Make biscuits. Everything's going to be fine. Be nice to people smile, remember to smile. Don't choke anyone today. Did they burn Speaker 1 (01:38): Your green beans? Speaker 2 (01:39): Now choke somebody. It's that sort of thing. It's peace and tranquility Speaker 1 (01:42): That's way deeper than I would've expected. I was just like, cool skulls, spooky. I like it. And then I got the dragon ring just because I like Speaker 2 (01:51): The tar and I don't know, I have to have reasons to wear things because then if I do TV things, they're like, well, what's that for? And if I go, I dunno, I like it. Then they go Speaker 1 (02:01): Shallow. And then I'm like, I don't feel like probably, I mean, do you think a lot of television is really making that sort of deep assessments? I feel like probably the programs themselves are rather shallow, right? Speaker 2 (02:13): No, they're not making that. But they ask you a million questions to see what they can pull out for content. Speaker 1 (02:18): Well, that's true. Yeah. Just like anything might be, Speaker 2 (02:20): Yeah, whatever triggers your emotional state. So Speaker 1 (02:24): Yeah, I don't know if you know this about me, but I'm obsessed with the Bachelor and Bachelorette, and I do a lot of extra reading on the subject. I want to know about how the show is made and things nice. One of the things they do often is to get all those reactions from people is they'll ask them crazy outlandish questions. Would you ever want to eat a raw rat? And then the person will be like, Ooh, gross, why would you say that? And then they'll edit that out. And then they have a little great soundbite of somebody going, Ooh, gross. Why would you ever say that? And then when Tricia or whoever on the show is talking about something else completely unrelated, but they want to make it sound dramatic, they have the soundbite of somebody going, Ew, gross. Why would you ever say that in those sort of interviews on the side, that they'll pull out reality Speaker 2 (03:13): Tv? Speaker 1 (03:13): Yeah. Isn't that great? I mean, she did say that, but she was saying it about something totally different. Yeah, I Speaker 2 (03:18): Was going to say, anytime that I've, thus far in my tumultuous TV things, everything that they've used has been cut pretty much in tandem with the timeline of the scene or whatever's going on. I haven't seen them muse anything out of sequence. No Speaker 1 (03:37): Real manipulation of super dodgy stuff. But I mean, it's probably also because not on something where it's about, yeah, it's not about deep emotions or trying to create drama where it doesn't necessarily exist. The Speaker 2 (03:52): Food creates drama. So whether or not you cook the food appropriately creates trauma, Speaker 1 (03:57): That's all they care about. You don't have to have somebody, it's not so much about interpersonal fighting or something like that, which is Speaker 2 (04:04): What I mean occasionally, well, guy told me to do this. I told him he could shut up. And then Speaker 1 (04:09): You're Speaker 2 (04:10): Like, oh no. And then they show it and it's like, yeah, occasionally. There's occasionally Speaker 1 (04:15): Those moments where you're like, I Speaker 2 (04:17): Didn't want to do that. He said, I think the pork and beans are bad. And I said, they're good. And then we got raw. Occasionally that happens, but it's over. That sort of stuff. The fort goes on the left. No, it doesn't. Some of the, and then there's fighting. Oh my gosh. Speaker 1 (04:33): That's the reality TV music cue you just did. There was so spot on. Because that is exactly, there's a lot of sort of circusy music in reality TVs that are supposed to tell you, look at this clown whenever something's going on and you're like Speaker 2 (04:53): Just a whimsy. Speaker 1 (04:55): When somebody's doing something silly, somebody would be in a cooking show if they're just putting like, oh, they've messed this up royally. And so the person is just going around about their thing. Normally they don't know what they've done, so they have to put the music under it to make you understand, this is pretty funny what's happening. Speaker 2 (05:15): You see that a lot on worse cooks just because none of them know how to cook at the beginning. Speaker 1 (05:19): And they'll be like, I took Speaker 2 (05:20): This packet of ramen and I put Jello in it. And then it's just because that person clearly doesn't know how to cook. And then the reaction shot of Amber L's, Speaker 1 (05:32): Like, then Speaker 2 (05:36): They're producing. But other than that, I haven't Speaker 1 (05:38): Experienced the bachelor bachelorette lifestyle of Speaker 2 (05:41): Tv. Speaker 1 (05:42): Well, that's probably for the best. It sounds like. It's actually terrible to be in their shoes. I wouldn't envy anyone who actually was on that show. So you've probably had a lot better doing the kind of shows you've done. I think Speaker 2 (05:52): So, Speaker 1 (05:52): Yeah. But yeah, maybe just tell us a little bit about yourself and what you do. Speaker 2 (05:59): So my name is Christian Gill. I'm the executive chef and co-owner of BoomTown Biscuits and Whiskey down on 12th and Broadway in Pendleton. I am the former executive chef of the Cincinnati Art Museum, which is Speaker 1 (06:11): How I had this sweet connections. Cool hookup. There it is. Speaker 2 (06:16): Let's see. I'm a cancer Leo Cusp, and I like long walks in the forest. Anyway, how'd you get Speaker 1 (06:22): Into the Biscuit biz? How'd you get there? How'd that start? Speaker 2 (06:25): Well, their biscuit biz, so PJ Newman, the other owner of BoomTown was actually a judge who's a guest judge for the Arts Wave Food Show campaign at the Art museum, what, three years ago. Oh Speaker 1 (06:41): My gosh. Speaker 2 (06:42): And he approached me after it was over. I won the, it's when we were splitting the team. So we had Baroque era, we had all the different eras of art, and I was on the broke team, and I won for Best Drink, but I didn't win for Best Food. And P G A approached me after we were done and he was like, Hey man, we're friends on Facebook, but we've never met in person. I have this idea for a really cool restaurant concept, biscuits, and that's all he said. And I was like, oh, okay, we will talk about it. And then literally, what, two years later, biscuits. Speaker 1 (07:16): That's insane. I can't believe anything like a career move came out of that event, which is insane. Speaker 2 (07:23): That's a weird event for there to be a career move after some of the costumes that we've seen, Sean Thompson's, David Bowie, and all the other things he's done. Speaker 1 (07:32): Was that sort of the beginning of getting television attention and things was from BoomTown? I can't even remember now, Speaker 2 (07:39): Actually, no. So the end of my art museum career was when I started getting attention for a couple of different shows. But my transition of leaving the art museum and then starting to work on BoomTown and then being attached to other things, I did some tour chef gigs for different music festival things and cooking for different artists and did that sort of thing. But because I wasn't attached to a physical restaurant because my restaurant wasn't built yet, it was harder to get locked in on some of those shows. I spent a year trying to get on a show, just interview after interview and Skype interview and cooking and pictures and all this stuff. But because I was not physically attached to a restaurant, they were like, eh, we don't know if you're a real chef or not. Speaker 1 (08:29): It doesn't have Speaker 2 (08:29): The Speaker 1 (08:29): Cred of having a restaurant. Speaker 2 (08:32): So many people that I guess in the past have been like, I'm a personal chef, or I'm a private chef, and then they just make Speaker 1 (08:38): Green bean casserole, right? Speaker 2 (08:39): And Speaker 1 (08:39): They're like, you're liar. And so then they just wanted Speaker 2 (08:42): To make sure it's a safety net for tv. I get it. So that happened, Speaker 1 (08:45): But Speaker 2 (08:45): Then BoomTown still, I got on my first show and BoomTown was not open. A guy big project actually happened without BoomTown. And then guys, grocery games was just like, I don't know, everything just started to build after that. Oh, that's cool. And then it's just been, I mean, any show that I'm on, I'm like, boom. Yeah, Speaker 1 (09:02): Biscuits. I have a restaurant to be like, Speaker 2 (09:05): This is mine. I make biscuits. But then the downside to that is, and everyone's like, do you just make biscuits? You don't make anything else. I'm like, no. I make a lot of things. I'm a creator. Speaker 1 (09:15): Yeah. I'm a little sad you didn't bring biscuits today because I'm just really hungry already. I'm Speaker 2 (09:20): Sorry. Speaker 1 (09:20): No, it's fine. It's fine. I didn't expect you to, but I mean, I hoped you would, but I didn't expect you. I apologize. No, no, man. So when I start early, I'm normally fine eating a late lunch and I'll go to one and I'll be like, oh, I guess I should eat. But when I start at eight, for some reason, just shifting an hour earlier, I am ravenous dark by 11 o'clock. And at Speaker 2 (09:47): 10 45, Speaker 1 (09:48): I looked down at my watch, I was like, I don't have a watch. What am I talking about? I looked at my phone and I was like, I am so hungry already. Speaker 2 (09:59): I'm sorry. Speaker 1 (10:00): That's the general Speaker 2 (10:00): Consensus. Whenever I go somewhere, Speaker 1 (10:02): Everyone assumes you'll bring biscuits. Speaker 2 (10:03): They're like, you bring biscuits. I'm like, you Speaker 1 (10:04): Got them right? You got them biscuits right now, where them biscuits at? I'm like, Speaker 2 (10:07): Is that a form of currency for you guys? Well, Speaker 1 (10:10): I'll let Speaker 2 (10:10): You into this v i P area if you got some biscuits. I'm like, is Speaker 1 (10:13): That Speaker 2 (10:13): What I need? So is Speaker 1 (10:15): Biscuits something you had any kind of, I don't know, emotional attachment to, or this a silly question, I Speaker 2 (10:22): Dunno. No, no. I grew up, so I grew up making biscuits with my grandmother and my mom and my grandmother taught me how to make biscuits. So it was definitely a part of my childhood and it was a major part of my childhood. I grew up in Lexington, Kentucky, and most of my family's from south Georgia and then western Kentucky. So the south is ingrained in my cooking skills. So it was a lot of biscuits and a lot of southern cooking. So it came natural to create an elevated comfort food menu at BoomTown. But yeah, so it's not just a passing fancy. Speaker 1 (10:56): Yeah. I remember the first time I went, I was going to get one thing that was mostly biscuit centric and I changed my mind. I was like, I don't know, biscuits are pretty intense really, if you eat a lot of them. I remember going to a restaurant once that had all, you can eat biscuits and gravy. And I was like, let's do this. And I realized I can't eat that many biscuits because you get one in there and you're like, yeah, I feel pretty good. But I will say, I feel like your biscuits are not that kind of, they don't feel quite as heavy and as dense as some biscuits that just, I feel like I've just eaten a brick. Speaker 2 (11:38): Yeah, Speaker 1 (11:39): It's purposes. So actually after I ate 'em, I was like, oh, I could have totally done the whole biscuit meal basically, because the biscuit special, I don't know the whole biscuit Speaker 2 (11:49): Special, Speaker 1 (11:51): I don't know what it was called, but I'm like, I could have really actually done that with Speaker 2 (11:55): These Speaker 1 (11:55): Biscuits. They're actually light enough that they wouldn't have just made me feel like Speaker 2 (12:00): Heavy and sad. I shouldn't Speaker 1 (12:02): Have done that. Right. I feel like every time I eat pancakes, that's how I feel Speaker 2 (12:06): Basically. I agree on the pancake for Speaker 1 (12:08): Every time I eat pancakes, it's like waffles too. You're just like, why did I do this? Speaker 2 (12:13): You're like, I'll take a stack of three. And then they're the size of the plate and you're like, totally. I'm like, I'm good. And then you're halfway Speaker 1 (12:19): Through, you're like, I must finish. Yeah, Speaker 2 (12:22): No, our biscuits are so after, I don't know, honestly, dude, like 300 iterations. Really? Yeah. I'm like a biscuit sommelier now because I bite a biscuit and then spit it out. I'm like, that one's good. There are so many different variations that we did. And the one we finally came up with, it's all about the ingredients, Speaker 1 (12:43): Better Speaker 2 (12:44): Ingredients, better biscuits. BoomTown, Speaker 1 (12:48): You just made up a new tagline there. Speaker 2 (12:50): I mean, I just took the one from Papa John's and made it Speaker 1 (12:53): Better, is what I did. Speaker 2 (12:55): I'll risk it for the biscuit. Alright. Dang it. But yeah, Speaker 1 (12:59): No, so Speaker 2 (13:00): Better. We use high quality ingredients. We use a soft wheat flour. It's real. I mean it's like chef nerd complicated, but it's fun. Soft wheat flour is literally a flour that yields a lighter gluten development than regular flour does or pizza flour. So that's why the biscuits are so fluffy. That's also why it allows us to make them so layered and use different lamination techniques just because that flour allows us to not develop as much gluten. So it's not sticky, it's not as heavy, it's not as chalky. So I'm real happy with them. Speaker 1 (13:33): You're a real biscuit scientist. Speaker 2 (13:34): I had to be in order to open biscuit Speaker 1 (13:37): Restaurant, Speaker 2 (13:37): So dang Speaker 1 (13:38): It. I kind of noticed you had this sort of San Francisco Gold rush kind of Oh, 1849 ERs. Yeah. Where did that come from? Where did that sort of idea happen? Speaker 2 (13:49): So that's all PJ Newman, the other owner. His big thing is creating an experience and creating a brand. He's definitely a cocktail and spirit sort of guy, but creating a brand that's memorable, that is immersive throughout the entirety of your experience in a place and specifically a restaurant. And so the 1850s gold rush really isn't something that's talked about a lot. It's not something that's explored a lot. You get it in westerns occasionally you'll have some prospector panning for gold. But that's a story he wanted to tell. And it created kind of a challenge because I had to research actual journal entries and logs of people that lived back in the 1850s, 1849, 1850s on the West coast and just the frontier and the organ trail, not the game, but the actual trail. And I had to actually do a legitimate amount of research to figure out what it was that they ate. Speaker 2 (14:49): Because when we opened I it to be as, pay as much homage to that experience as possible. So there are things that are still on our menu that are reflective of the times and what they ate, what they drank. The types of our kale salad right now has a tomato vinegarette on it. That's where Western and French dressing actually comes from is they would make a tomato vinegar and then just reinforce it out west and all you can eat. Buffet actually started in out west in Chinese mining camps. Oh really? Yeah, because the mining camps were so segregated and they wanted to make money. So then they would open these chow halls. You get one plate, you pay one price and you could just eat all day. It was all you can eat. And so that's the first American all you can eat Chinese buffet was during the 1850s. Speaker 1 (15:37): Wow. Speaker 2 (15:38): Because of racism. But there's just all these things that came out of that. And so I tried to explore those different avenues to create a cohesive brunch menu. That's why our shrimp and grits is a tie inspiration to it with our coconut chili gravy, the lemongrass sauce that's on the shrimp. Try to actually chef and not just be Brits Speaker 1 (16:00): If you haven't gone. It's a great experience because of that, I think it does sound like maybe it's going to be a little simpler than it is. And then when you get there, you're like, oh no, there's a lot of options here. And that you really can have something like you're saying Thai influenced biscuits and gravy does. That's not necessarily what people might expect when they walk in the door, Speaker 2 (16:22): Not even a little bit. And then we also make different gravy every week, every, we make different jams, jellies and pickles every week. So that's where myself and my chef de cuisine are really able to express ourselves. Culinarily is by making those different pickles, jams, jellies. We have a pickle program. We are working on developing canning classes, canning and jamming classes, and then also biscuit classes as well. So we do a lot for just being a biscuit brunch restaurant. And it's funny because people come in and we'll put elaborate specials together and not even so complex that they would be considered fine dining. We just will build cool flavor profiles and people will come in and they just want the chicken biscuit sandwich with the cheddar cheese and the gravy and the bacon. And so our service will be like, oh, we have this really cool rabbit special this week, or we have this awesome salad and people are Yukon and they're like, oh, you want the chickens? And I'm like, yeah, just bring me a Yukon. That's all I want. Yukon. And then you're just like, well hold on. We've had this really cool gravy Yukon. And I'm like, all right, fine. So there's something for everyone on our menu, Speaker 2 (17:35): Yukon. It's literally what people do. People will sit down and Speaker 1 (17:39): Just scream Yukon Speaker 2 (17:40): At you and scream Yukon. Or I'll go to the table. I'm like, how is everything today? I'll see one person with a special. I'm like, how's the special? I was good, but I had some of that Yukon and I'm like, okay, Speaker 1 (17:51): I get it. What is the Yukon for those who don't know, Speaker 2 (17:53): That is our buttermilk biscuit with buttermilk, brine fried chicken maple, smoked cheddar, applewood smoked bacon, and then our sawmill sausage gravy. Speaker 1 (18:02): Alright, Speaker 2 (18:03): So it is a meal in a sandwich. We call it a pick and shovel sandwich. You have to actually break it down with a coconut egg. And that's our most popular thing. And then we also have a vegan and vegetarian option called the Oregon Trail. It won't give you a decent tree. No one's forwarding the river today. Speaker 1 (18:24): That is our Speaker 2 (18:26): Fried sweet potato hash with a Korean BOGO sauce, fried kale, sauteed poblano peppers, onions and Brussels sprouts, carrots. And it's pretty Dan, it's kind of like a sweet potato Korean be beam bop. That's for anybody that likes Korean Speaker 1 (18:42): Food. Speaker 2 (18:43): It's basically what that is. But those are our two most popular options besides just biscuits and gravy. Speaker 1 (18:47): Well, before we go out to the galleries, is there anything else we should know about BoomTown biscuits or anything else you got going on right now? Speaker 2 (18:54): I mean, I'm working on a second restaurant nice concept right now for Cincinnati. So it's about time. Can't say what it is yet, but it's coming. You guys really like food. Speaker 1 (19:09): If you eat, Speaker 2 (19:10): If you eat like to eat, come on down, Speaker 1 (19:15): Keep your mouths ready, Speaker 2 (19:18): Hold your forehead knife at the ready because load it coming. So working on that, working on some cool other things, maybe in some other various forms of media as well. So there's a lot going on. A lot of Speaker 1 (19:32): Stuff you can't actually talk about. Yeah, the lot Speaker 2 (19:34): Of things I can just tease, I just enticing. Speaker 1 (19:36): Well awesome. Well I thought we would go out to the galleries and my idea was that we could come up with, and by we, I mean I'm not going to do this, you're much better at this. Basically come up with what would be an appropriate meal to pair with a work of art. Sort of this taste. Basically Speaker 2 (19:57): This art tastes like duck. Alright, Speaker 1 (19:59): Cool. Let's do it. So let's go out to the galleries up. Alright, we are now in Gallery two 11 and this is American art, mostly all sort of 20th century art. I'm probably all 20th century art. I'm just saying that to cover my tracks in case there's something in here from 1899, but it's all very early 20th century. So we are going to look at these artworks and what I want you to do is to kind of create what you think would be a good meal pairing with them. What would be a good dish or what are the flavors it kind of brings out if you don't want to be that specific, that's fine. If you want to check the links on the show notes on the podcast description, I'll include links to these paintings wherever I can. A lot of them are under copyright, but we might have sort of approved versions on our website. So I'll include links to whatever paintings that we talk about that we are allowed to reproduce. And actually we're already facing a piece that I think would be a good starting point. We're looking at Georgia O'Keefe's, my Backyard, and I feel like this has some real specific directions it could go. So where does it take you immediately? Speaker 2 (21:28): So just from the name of the piece and then the brightness of the piece. I would like to go with a salad. So my backyard, so I'm automatically thinking garden in the backyard. And then there's assuming those are hills or mountainous region behind the yard. Speaker 1 (21:51): So she lives in Santa Fe area. Okay. So this is sort of big kind of deserty mountains. Speaker 2 (22:00): So then you've got a little bit of, I dunno, pastel reds, pinks, and then the golden yellow from that Canvassy Santa Fe area. So I'm thinking like a panzanella salad. So stale focaccia breadcrumbs, large croutons, and then heirloom tomatoes just because you've got the reds, the yellows, and the greens. So it'd be really cool to have heirloom tomatoes. And I'd probably do a watermelon vinegarette chunks of grilled watermelon. Speaker 1 (22:30): Pinky color. Yeah, because Speaker 2 (22:32): Lots of pink there. So Speaker 1 (22:33): That's interesting. That's like I wouldn't have taken it in that direction maybe because of just, but thinking about that in the foods, it kind of makes you think of, even now that you say watermelon, the pink and the green of this make me kind of go to watermelon too. Speaker 2 (22:45): And then they're the little smattering of the desert brush Speaker 1 (22:50): Santa Speaker 2 (22:50): Fe brush along the mountain line that makes me think. So fresh herbs, I would probably do curly parsley, sage and thyme, but I'd fry all of those herbs. So cos chop fry and then garnish the salad with that and the watermelon vinaigrette. Speaker 1 (23:05): What's the frying do? Speaker 2 (23:06): The frying just adds a different texture to the herbs because you're going to have kind of a wet salad from the tomatoes, the watermelon vinaigrette, and of course chunks of grilled watermelon. So having the fresh fried herbs just adds texture and brings out just a different flavor component to those herbs as well. Sometimes sage can be kind of bitter if you use too much sage as well as thme. You got all the timey in the world, you get real bitter. So if you fry those components, it just brings out a bright and sweet crisp flavor profile to those things. Speaker 1 (23:37): Alright, that's my backyard Speaker 2 (23:39): There it is. Speaker 1 (23:40): My backyard salad from Christian. Alright, well let's go over to, this is probably one of the most famous paintings in the museum and it's kind of insane that I don't think I've ever talked about it in this podcast ever. Really? Speaker 2 (23:51): Yeah, Speaker 1 (23:52): It's been on loan a lot while we've been doing it, so Speaker 2 (23:55): It's Speaker 1 (23:55): Probably, there's been a lot of times where, oh, this would be perfect, but it was off view or we just didn't have the right topic to bring it up. So we might even talk about it more in depth in a future episode. But this is Daughters of Revolution by Grant Wood, famous for American Gothic. So this one, I'm kind of curious where you're going to take, because it doesn't necessarily, it doesn't strike me as appetizing as the last painting. It doesn't, Speaker 2 (24:23): This painting, the colors are not, they don't pop as much. It's not quite the range or expansive colors either, but Speaker 1 (24:33): It feels, I mean both subject matter wise too and kind of palette. It's much more kind conservative Speaker 2 (24:40): Feeling. It's very conservative. These ladies look like they probably make the same roast every day of the week and for their very, very, very lazy husbands. But they're holding the tea cup, which is definitely oriental in design. Speaker 1 (25:01): Yeah, it's like a pretty famous China pattern on that cup. It's like the blue willow design, which is a little bit of the irony of this painting. I mean, if some background about the painting. Grant Wood had been commissioned to do some project in a church. It was a stained glass window. He had been commissioned to design, there was a German manufacturer and the local d a R objected to it and made a big stink about hiring Germans at the time to produce this window. So he sort of making fun of their supposed patriotism. So the Chinese design is kind of a little small detail that's also poking fun of these supposedly deeply patriotic women. Speaker 2 (25:49): So then you know what I'm going to do then, just from the background that you just gave me and these women being so smug, I'm going to further expand that. These very smug women then made a cobe beef teriyaki burger. So the American cheeseburger, but they used cobe beef, made a teriyaki sauce, and of course they topped it with Goa a Dutch cheese. A Dutch cheese. So then we're going to go with a Kobe beef burger cheeseburger teriyaki glaze. Ooh, it should be on Speaker 1 (26:26): A Kaiser roll. Yes, Speaker 2 (26:29): We're doing this together. I like this Speaker 1 (26:30): On a Kaiser roll. I was trying to think of something German for you there. That was great. And then Speaker 2 (26:34): We're of course going to use a stone ground German mustard as well. We're going to use not even a stone ground mustard, we're going to use the Dusseldorf mustard because that's one of my favorite mustards ever. Speaker 1 (26:45): Nice, nice. That's great. Let's that, yeah, that's perfect. Yeah, so the painting behind them, this painting of Washington crossing the Delaware that they have a print of that's framed behind their heads here is also painted by e Emmanuel Lutz, who is a German artist who painted probably one of the most famous American iconic paintings ever, but he's actually German. So it was another little ironic twist to this painting. Say that the irony is Speaker 2 (27:12): Killing me inside. Speaker 1 (27:14): Yeah, Speaker 2 (27:14): I Speaker 1 (27:14): Love this painting. It's just snarky, isn't it? It Speaker 2 (27:16): Is. And we just have a snarky burger for it too. That's Speaker 1 (27:19): Great. That's great. It's a good choice. Okay, I like it. So I feel like this one man, I don't know, maybe this is a bad choice, but Speaker 2 (27:26): This is a great choice. You Speaker 1 (27:27): Think so? Speaker 2 (27:27): Okay. Speaker 1 (27:27): Alright, so this is Henry Teel, a portrait of Henry Teel, you could call it by Andrew Wyeth. And a very, I was thinking it might be a bad choice just because I feel like it's kind of a bummer of a painting. It's very sad and kind of isolated looking, but it also has a real location connection to which is Maine, which is where this is taking place. And I kind of feel like even though it's all interior, you get a sense of that place very much from this painting. Speaker 2 (28:04): And even with him looking outside and you have just a little bit of the landscape outside that you can see him being the only resident of Teal's Island and it's, it's a very sad painting, but I feel like he needs happy food. Speaker 1 (28:18): So you're going to try to cheer him up with your menu? Speaker 2 (28:20): I'm going to try to cheer him up with a menu. Also, we're in Maine, so we're going to go for rock lobster that's just been baked. So split and baked, rock, lobster, and honestly, just some biscuits. I know's Speaker 1 (28:34): A settlement. Oh, you had to? Speaker 2 (28:35): I had to because he just looks so sad. And even though I'm trying to cheer him up with a lobster, but he's probably, I can get a lobster all day long. So it's probably not really that, it's not that illustrious to give him lobster. But a simple rock lobster meal, split, baked, a little bit of butter, couple of fresh herbs, just parsley, oregano, and then a side of biscuits just to sop up some of the sauce with, that's kind of it, because I mean the simplicity of the single chair at his table, the crack door, just the gray color pal, this man, he doesn't look that upset and lonely though. Speaker 1 (29:14): No, no, he doesn't. He looks Speaker 2 (29:15): Content to be isolated by himself. And obviously the other chair from the table he's using, he's got up against the window. So maybe at one point in time there was a misses and she's gone now. That's what we can infer. And she used to make him rock lobster with biscuits. Speaker 1 (29:30): Well, I like that it used the sort of simplicity of the painting to sort of make a simple meal. But I'll be honest, I started this episode hungry and it's not getting better. You're welcome. That one, especially as you were describing, I'm like, oh my God, this sounds amazing. I want to eat that too. Speaker 3 (29:49): But for him, it's so simple. Simply Henry Teal. Speaker 1 (29:55): I don't think we'll do every painting in this gallery unless you want, I mean, unless you really want to do this one. I was going to skip this one. That's Speaker 2 (30:02): Fine. We can. Speaker 1 (30:03): So this one is the old folks mother and father by John Stewart Curry. What do you think? Speaker 2 (30:10): Well, I see the farm in the background. I see the cattle and they have the small dog that's inside with them. He's got his overalls on, but it looks like he has his nice shoes on probably because they're sitting in the sitting room. There's the old phone on the wall, the top left, the message above it. So this just says, honestly, Speaker 3 (30:35): This is Speaker 2 (30:37): Just country, just farmland, Americana. So I'm thinking a farm to table meal, so a fresh cut hanger, steak, potatoes, Speaker 1 (30:47): And Speaker 2 (30:47): Then a sweet potato and carrot mashed puree. And the reason that we did that is because we have those hard hardboiled potatoes with the steak. So we did steak and potatoes, but then we're going to take the carrots and elevate those just because there's a lot of browns and a touch of orange number in this painting. So I'm thinking something a little bit warmer, a little bit of cinnamon in there. Maybe she makes sweet potato carrot mash as a dessert, but he wants it for dinner. And so we've got that on the plate. And then just for a little bit of green thinking broccoli, but we're going to do garlic, roasted broccoli florets, and just a touch of Holland. Speaker 1 (31:26): Wow. No, you pulled that out. That was great. Speaker 2 (31:29): I mean, this painting, it definitely inspires more of, like I said, an Americana continental steak and potato sort of meal. It's not quite as simple as old Henry Teel down there as lobster and biscuits, but it's very pleasant outside the rolling clouds. You can see often the distance, the path they're laying down to the farm and a couple of cattle grazing outside of the fence over there. It just seems like it's pretty happy painting. They seem very content, even though they're not talking to each other and he's looking outside kind of like, I wish he'd hurry up and knit this scarf from me. But it just seems very, very much an Americana, Americana painting that needs an Americana meal. Speaker 1 (32:10): Yeah, totally. Well, it is an American gallery. We're an American gallery. It makes sense that we're kind of hitting a lot of American topics with this, Speaker 2 (32:19): Even though, I mean the Daughters Speaker 3 (32:22): Of the Bitter, smug ladies of the Revolution, they did have a co baby burger. Speaker 2 (32:26): So Speaker 1 (32:27): Now I'm worried this one also might be in that range of too obvious since it literally depicts a meal that it's like, maybe I'm not giving you enough to interpret, but this is Christmas morning breakfast by Horace Pippen. And so he's a sort of self-taught artist, and this is sort of depicting kind of one of his memories basically of childhood. And we do have some food in the picture, which is those pancakes we were discussing earlier. Yep, Speaker 2 (33:00): Yep. Speaker 1 (33:01): So how would you reimagine this as an actual meal? Speaker 2 (33:07): Okay, so I see the wood-burning stove off to the left Speaker 1 (33:10): Tea Speaker 2 (33:10): Kettle and then an additional kettle and what looks like a cast iron and skillet. Speaker 1 (33:16): Yeah, we were actually just talking about these, what was on the stoves? I was trying to decide if this is an old coffee maker, the green, that's Speaker 2 (33:22): Kind of what it looks like. Speaker 1 (33:23): Yeah, the shape of it reminds me of an old coffee maker. It would make sense that it's on top of the stove for that reason too, because there's, there's a Speaker 2 (33:30): Teapot next to it. So I think that's what that is. So I'm thinking of sticking with the pancake, but instead we're going to do a cast iron dutch baby pancake. Speaker 1 (33:41): So Speaker 2 (33:42): Dutch baby, for those of you all that don't know, that is a pancake where we heat up butter in a very hot skillet and then we pour a pancake batter into the hot skillet and then put the pancake batter skillet into the oven. We bake that for about seven to eight minutes. And what comes out of the oven is a very fluffy, very light pancake, souffle of sorts. So a Dutch baby pancake, it's Christmas morning. You know what we're going to put chunks of bacon, scrambled egg, and then also some fresh sliced tomatoes on there just because it is New York. And they would be able to get tomatoes at all points in time in the season. Speaker 1 (34:20): All right. Speaker 2 (34:20): Yeah, we're going to do that. Then just a little bit of maple syrup, not even anything special with that. Speaker 1 (34:26): Okay. All right. Well, let's see. I won't make you make an ol Speaker 2 (34:33): No. Speaker 1 (34:34): Yeah, I feel like we'll skip that one. That one seems like a little tricky. Speaker 2 (34:40): I mean, we could do a cocktail instead of doing a Speaker 1 (34:44): That's true. You want to develop a cocktail that's based on cocktail, a mouthwash. Speaker 2 (34:49): So let's go real simple. Let's do an elder flour and bitters infused gin cocktail with a little bit of champagne. And then we're going to express lemon and then garnish with fresh mint and a dash of cayenne pepper. Speaker 1 (35:12): Nice. On the menu it has to say it purifies. It purifies. Oh no, Speaker 2 (35:18): It purifies. Speaker 1 (35:21): Yeah, Speaker 2 (35:21): That wasn't that Speaker 1 (35:22): Hard. We Speaker 2 (35:23): Got a beverage in there. Speaker 1 (35:24): Yeah, that's good. It's good. It's complex. It's good to mix it up. I'm going to keep it just to the paintings. Check up. Check it up, check it up. So this was the one I was saying I didn't necessarily want to, I was worried it was a little too on the nose because it's literally food, fruits Speaker 2 (35:39): And vegetables, Speaker 1 (35:40): Right? So it's called fruits and vegetables. But I mean, hey, maybe it's great. I mean, one of the things that this painting has different, this is by Jacob Lawrence, I should have said. And one of the things that separates it, I think from a lot of the other paintings in this room is that it's so much more colorful. Speaker 2 (35:56): It is. Speaker 1 (35:56): And so much more vibrant. So I mean, maybe that could be taking you somewhere that, apart from just the subject matter, but Speaker 2 (36:04): So I am already all over this. I want to do a Moroccan corn salad. I see what looks to be butternut squash over on the left side underneath the scale I see corn over on the far right, I think she's weighing potatoes. So Moroccan corn salad. We're going to have figs, fresh figs, dried dates, corn that's been sauteed over an open flame with pieces of roasted butternut squash. We're going to throw in some clove, cayenne allspice, and then definitely tamarind and then some curry powder. And then we're going to use Fresno peppers on the garnish just so that it gives us some more color pop. And then for the green, I think I see she's got green plantains over there, like un ripened bananas Speaker 1 (36:58): Or green Speaker 2 (36:58): Plantains. And then so there's some fresh lime down there. So we're actually going to do candied lime peel as well. So the salad is going to be super, super spice rich, not very salty, not salty, not super sweet. The sweetness coming from the corn and the squash, but then a little bit of spice from that Fresno pepper. And then also the spices that we have in the dish. And I just kind of see all of that just from not only the ethnicity of the people in the painting people, but also just the colors. And when I think of an open air market, fruit and vegetable market, I think of a spice market in Morocco from this painting as well. So there's some cross interpretation of both Americana fruit and vegetable market, and then also the spice markets of Morocco. So I see a lot going on here, and that's what I want to do. Speaker 1 (37:47): Nice. Well thank you so much Christian, for doing this and for, I'm never going to look at these paintings the same way I going to suddenly my stomach's going to start growling every time I walk through. Here. Come. Nice. Thanks for having me, Russell, since memory of this moment, especially Henry Tale, I'm going to think about biscuits and lobster. Always. Speaker 2 (38:06): As soon as we went up to that painting, I was like, lobster. Lobster or try the gray stuff. It's delicious from Beauty and the Beast. It's one of those two things, Speaker 1 (38:18): But I think you made the better choice. I think I Speaker 2 (38:20): Did Speaker 1 (38:20): Too. I think Disney's got that on lockdown. I Speaker 2 (38:22): Think they do. Speaker 1 (38:23): Their lawyers would come knocking on our doors for just even mentioning it. Phone. I Speaker 2 (38:26): Mean, I used to work at Disney, so the microchip turned on, so it's Speaker 1 (38:29): Twitching already. Oh my gosh. Okay. This was the thing I have failed is by, we could have just made this podcast. Okay, last one last note is that I remember probably when I started working here, I don't think, and when did you start working here? Speaker 2 (38:45): I started working here in 2013. Speaker 1 (38:47): Okay. So Speaker 2 (38:48): Started February, March. Speaker 1 (38:49): Okay. We must've started right around the same time. I started in April of 2013. So I remember going to special events meetings where we started actually putting a time into the meeting to let you just tell stories about working at Disney. Yes, I remember that. I remember that. You were just like, okay, it's time for Christian's, Disney stories. And they were amazing. Those nightmares Speaker 2 (39:13): Of work. I miss those days just because they've made me who I am. I have a lot of Speaker 1 (39:19): Patience now Speaker 2 (39:20): And I can smile a lot longer than I used to be able to. But like, oh man. All the stories. All the Speaker 1 (39:26): Stories Speaker 2 (39:26): That no one's going to get on the podcast, Speaker 1 (39:28): I know know. They were so, so delicious. And as a person who both loves theme parks and also loves hearing about Speaker 2 (39:34): Weird Speaker 1 (39:36): Sort of dark sides of things and sort of the darkness underneath the Speaker 2 (39:41): Darkness of Disney, the happiest Speaker 1 (39:42): Place on earth, man, nothing made me happier than hearing these Speaker 2 (39:45): Stories, the unhappiest place on earth. It was good though. Speaker 1 (39:49): It was a fun time. Speaker 2 (39:51): I remember that though. We should get the special events crew together. They'll be like, who is this Speaker 1 (39:57): Yahoo Speaker 2 (39:57): That came in here with purple Speaker 1 (39:58): Hair? He doesn't work here anymore. We don't want to hear anything about him. Why is he telling us about escorting Johnny Depp around Speaker 2 (40:06): Disneyland? Why is he talking about the Bill Cosby before? We don't want to hear that damaged people. Speaker 1 (40:13): Alright, well thank you so much, Christian. Of course, Russell. Thank you for listening to Art Palace. We hope you'll be inspired to come visit the Cincinnati Art Museum and have your own conversations about the art. General. Admission to the museum is always free, and we also offer free parking Special exhibitions on view right now are Kimono Refashioning, contemporary Style and No Spectators, the Art of Burning Man. Join us on August 25th at 3:00 PM for a free gallery experience on radical self-expression with artist and previous podcast guests, Pam Kravitz. Pam will talk about her current installation and other ways she radically expresses herself. For program, reservation and more information, visit cincinnati art museum.org. You can follow the museum on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Snapchat, and also join our Art Palace Facebook group. Our theme song is, oh, fron Music. How By Al. And if you enjoyed the show, why not leave us a nice reviewer rating? Or you can also take the survey which helps us learn more about our listeners@cincinnatiartmuseum.org slash podcast. I'm Russell eig, and this has been Art Palace produced by the Cincinnati Art Museum.